·
April Flowers I'm
suprise as a gay man Daniels doesn't like women for it is usually the women who
are more accepting of that lifestyle than men. When I see gay men, their
friends usually are either women or other gay men so don't know what his issues
are with women. Probably hates his mother for leaving him alone with his uncle
or boyfriend and why he is gay today.
Like · Reply · 1 · 10 February at 23:27
o
Lenora Young There
is a certain type of gay male that is envious of bio females, he is actually in
competition with women. He's the type to go after a straight male who is
coupled with a woman so his ego will feel good if he can turn that male. Of
course if he can't it's a great way to get a beat down or killed. Most down low
men actually hate women and get a thrill from using and fooling her. It's the
reason the fastest growing hiv infection rate is among monogamous heterosexual
black women.
‘Transphobic and
homophobic all in one the BWE huh’
Someone
please tell Faith Dow to calm down with her transphobia before she gets
‘glitterbombed’ like Germaine Greer, Christelyn Karazin knows to say nothing on
the issue, girl you better follow suit.
Before anyone starts claiming transphobia, here's the kicker:
"...no attempt would be made by
management to screen for males who might choose to access such spaces for
improper purposes..."
In other words... no one vetted or
confirmed the person this woman saw in the woman's locker room IS a transwoman.
Common Sense Trumps Male Dominance BS Schemes and I'd take myself over
to another gym. I get the company probably wants to avoid a lawsuit...but
they'll get another one if any of those 'self-identifiers' turn out to be your
garden variety misogynists, peeping toms or rapists.
"Days after the incident a
Planet Fitness corporate representative contacted Cormier and informed her they
had learned that she was discussing the incident with other women in the locker
room, and that women expressing “judgement” about their safety and privacy in
regard to sharing a locker room with men was a violation of the company’s “no
judgement” for women policy."
A woman in Midlands, Michigan was banned from the Planet Fitness gym and
had her membership revoked after she complained of being frightened by a man
in...
GENDERTRENDER.WORDPRESS.COM
·
Acts Of Faith In
Love & Life NOW IF SOMEONE WANTS TO ACTUALLY DISCUSS
THE MATTER AT HAND THAT I POSTED ABOUT. Planet Fitness having a hands off
policy devoid of any vetting where any male can claim to be a woman (no one
actually verified the man is trans by the way) and have access to the women's
locker room and canceling a membership because the patron asked for
accountability out of concern for her personal safety.
Like · Reply · 4 · 7 March at 23:07 · Edited
o
Jamesa Stokes That's
how you know they don't care. They aren't even trying to look feminine anymore.
If women refuse to work out there, the question is: will Planet Fitness feel it
on their bottom line? Most gyms cater to men clientele. But it's foolish to be
bullied into ignoring the concerns of half of the population to cater to the
1%.
Like · 4 · 7 March at 23:26 · Edited
o
Acts Of Faith In Love & Life I
guess they'll find out the hard way. Because Planet Fitness wants to play both
sides of the fence. That bit about the corporate office trying to silence the
member discussing her concerns with other members was a huge red flag. We don't
know if other...See More
Like · 4 · 7 March at 23:32
o
Jamesa Stokes The
transgender community is its own worst enemy sometimes. They put out their own
dirty laundry all over the internet, from publicly supporting violent criminals
to posting videos on YouTube all about weirding out women in bathrooms. It's
not difficult to find disgusting news.
Like · 2 · 7 March at 23:39 · Edited
o
GENDERTRENDER.WORDPRESS.COM
·
Megan Massa Also,
just to be clear, "man" and "woman" are gendered terms,
whereas "male" and "female" are biological/sex terms...so
calling a trans woman a "transgendered man" is a form of
miss-gendering
o
Acts Of Faith In Love & Life And
to be clear using the term "cis" ALSO misgenders real women. Since
you and Jamesa know each other you can continue your debate on your own feed.
Like · 2 · 7 March at 22:36 · Edited
o
Jamesa Stokes Acts Of Faith In
Love & Life I'm sorry Megan and I got into our own little
internal debate here. We'll carry on with this subject elsewhere. But thanks
for being the spring board again.
Like · 1 · 7 March at 22:46 · Edited
o
Acts Of Faith In Love & Life Thanks.
I just let her know on another reply she's about to get blocked for hijacking
the thread.
Like · 1 · 7 March at 22:48
...
·
Megan Massa Jamesa Stokes Agreeing
to disagree...but that doesn't mean we can't have an intellectual
conversation
I guess what I'm trying to say is that there's a difference between being a masculine woman and being a trans man (also between being an effeminate man and a trans woman). Adopting traits not normally associated with the end of the binary you were assigned at birth does not make you that gender. Self identification is an important aspect. Just because a woman is masculine doesn't mean she's not a woman. Similarly, a trans man can still be more effeminate than the stereotypical man. However, the latter is not what one typically sees represented because the trans community faces such physical abuse that a great deal of effort is placed into "passing." However, "passing" (either by expression, hormones, surgery, or some combination of the like) does not solve the problem of the dangers that the trans community faces, seeing as when a passing trans person is "outed," they are subject to the same physical assaults.
Another point that I'd like to dissect (especially because it's something that I haven't figured out myself) is whether changing rooms and bathrooms are based on gender or sex. In your response, you say that trans men, for example, should be advocating to cis women to allow them to still use "the women's room" based on their biology (and trans women to cis men). When those trans women and men are in the process of transitioning, either by expression or by hormones (things that generally take some time to complete and are not as instantaneous as surgery), then to which bathroom/locker room would they belong if we're basing our assessment on "biology"? Because, technically, a person in transition is "between genders" if we're sticking to a binary. I guess this is why people argue for the gender identity argument, because despite the physical and biological characteristics of the person in question, the gender identity remains constant. This latter is a question I don't know the answer to myself but would love to hear thoughts on...just "typing as I think/word vomit" sort of thing!
I guess what I'm trying to say is that there's a difference between being a masculine woman and being a trans man (also between being an effeminate man and a trans woman). Adopting traits not normally associated with the end of the binary you were assigned at birth does not make you that gender. Self identification is an important aspect. Just because a woman is masculine doesn't mean she's not a woman. Similarly, a trans man can still be more effeminate than the stereotypical man. However, the latter is not what one typically sees represented because the trans community faces such physical abuse that a great deal of effort is placed into "passing." However, "passing" (either by expression, hormones, surgery, or some combination of the like) does not solve the problem of the dangers that the trans community faces, seeing as when a passing trans person is "outed," they are subject to the same physical assaults.
Another point that I'd like to dissect (especially because it's something that I haven't figured out myself) is whether changing rooms and bathrooms are based on gender or sex. In your response, you say that trans men, for example, should be advocating to cis women to allow them to still use "the women's room" based on their biology (and trans women to cis men). When those trans women and men are in the process of transitioning, either by expression or by hormones (things that generally take some time to complete and are not as instantaneous as surgery), then to which bathroom/locker room would they belong if we're basing our assessment on "biology"? Because, technically, a person in transition is "between genders" if we're sticking to a binary. I guess this is why people argue for the gender identity argument, because despite the physical and biological characteristics of the person in question, the gender identity remains constant. This latter is a question I don't know the answer to myself but would love to hear thoughts on...just "typing as I think/word vomit" sort of thing!
o
Acts Of Faith In Love & Life All
of these debate points are moot. You're not speaking to women who have never
discussed trans issues and other activism. We're here to discuss setting
boundaries as (mostly) straight women because a few people who actually HATE us
are trying to shift the narrative to take advantage of women for their benefit.
Like · 3 · 7 March at 22:33
o
Megan Massa I
never assumed I was talking to uneducated people. I was just responding to the
language used in previous posts and comments in a thoughtful way. I am not
trying to attack anyone. If you read down through my entire comment here,
you'll see that I am also interested in exploring boundaries. However, I think
it's unfair to assume that straight women are the only ones affected by this
issue. And contrary to what you're saying, I don't think the intent is to take
advantage of women for their benefit. I think the whole issue revolves around
comfort and safety and who feels safe and comfortable where and with whom. And
obviously people are never going to agree, especially with the current system
being so based in on a stringent binary
Like · 1 · 7 March at 22:46
o
Acts Of Faith In Love & Life And
you don't read for comprehension because no one here assumes only straight women
anything..but all you want to do is dominate with your ideas of how wrong we
are in forming our own values and setting boundaries. As an intelligent person
you should know not to START and when to STOP debating with people who are
at PERMANENT points of disagreements. You're in MY thread and being
disrespectful. I've already suggested you MOVE ON. I don't need you to agree
with me on anything. Last time.
Like · 4 · 7 March at 22:56 · Edited
·
Megan Massa Sex
is different than gender, the former being biological and the second being a
performance based on social construction. Thus, biology is separate from gender
identification and presentation. Claiming that women with biological male
genitalia are not "true women" is harmful in so many ways. What if a
woman, assigned male at birth, is unable to access hormone therapy, for medical
or fiscal reasons? What if she is unwilling and unable to undergo a surgery
that could cause her complications in the future?
In the discussion about locker rooms, I can understand both sides of the argument - trans women deserve a place to change free of harassment, and cis women deserve to feel safe from male biology. However, I think that the conversation needs to be carried out with respect; misgendering trans women and labeling non-biologically-transitioned trans women as predators is not a good way to do that.
In the discussion about locker rooms, I can understand both sides of the argument - trans women deserve a place to change free of harassment, and cis women deserve to feel safe from male biology. However, I think that the conversation needs to be carried out with respect; misgendering trans women and labeling non-biologically-transitioned trans women as predators is not a good way to do that.
Like · Reply · 1 · 7 March at 20:41
o
Acts Of Faith In Love & Life Megan,
I can appreciate the sentiment as in words - but in the REAL WORLD that's just
not gonna fly. You've got transactivists telling lesbians they should be with
pre-op and no-op transwomen because they gender identify as women. If a LESBIAN
who identifies as being attracted to women with traditional "lady
parts" does NOT want to be with someone who doesn't have a vagina, how
inappropriate is it for a biological male who claims he's a woman to tell that
woman what she should be attracted to and be with? I don't like being in locker
rooms with other naked women who are strangers -- so I CERTAINLY do NOT want to
find myself in a forcibly unisex locker room with any RANDOM male who claims to
self-identify as a woman who hasn't even been VETTED. That is insanity! And for
all of these false debates what you WON'T find is these self-identified women
in the MEN'S locker room while you? That is male dominance trying to subjugate
women -- which is the core definition of misogyny. Transwomen have been around
for a long time. This push to dominate and let ANYONE who claims to be trans
dictate the narrative and freedoms of the rest of the general population is not
gonna fly.
Like · 3 · 7 March at 22:23
o
Megan Massa I
won't get into the debate on who "should" be with whom because the
definition of attraction is very different for so many people. One can be
attracted to gender presentation and appearahce, genetalia, personality, and
any combination there in (and more that I'm forgetting)!
When you say "vetted," what do you mean? How do you vet someone's gender identity? You certainly can't do it by their sexual history, since sexuality is distinct from gender; and you certainly can't do it by appearance, since they may be pre-transition. So what would the vetting process look like?
And I'm well aware of misogyny and the patriarchy. But actually, but limiting gender expression and the definition of gender through biology, you're actually playing INTO the binary set up by the patriarchy and REINFORCING the very misogyny we both dispise. Because claiming a biological definition of gender allows the patriarchy to continue subjugation of cis women based on their biological differences to cis men, the people in power upholding the patriarchy.
When you say "vetted," what do you mean? How do you vet someone's gender identity? You certainly can't do it by their sexual history, since sexuality is distinct from gender; and you certainly can't do it by appearance, since they may be pre-transition. So what would the vetting process look like?
And I'm well aware of misogyny and the patriarchy. But actually, but limiting gender expression and the definition of gender through biology, you're actually playing INTO the binary set up by the patriarchy and REINFORCING the very misogyny we both dispise. Because claiming a biological definition of gender allows the patriarchy to continue subjugation of cis women based on their biological differences to cis men, the people in power upholding the patriarchy.
o
Acts Of Faith In Love & Life I'm
done with entertaining your attempts at hijacking this thread. You've made your
point. No one here agrees with you and you're not adding anything of value.
It's time to move on. I don't have to convince you, show you proof or explain
anything to you. You cannot continue spouting off your opinions as facts to get
me to change my mind. So, this is your warning to move on before I block you.
If you want to continue debating this with Jamesa, you can do that on YOUR
timeline. NOT HERE.
Like · 1 · 7 March at 22:47
o
Acts Of Faith In Love & Life You
are being rude and domineering which is why you've been told to leave this
thread. No, my forum is NOT A FREE FOR ALL. An exchange of ideas with respect
is one thing. Someone who is solely focused on telling other people what to
think who've already established they don't agree with you is just a fight
waiting to happen for those who lack self-discipline. You made your point with
one to two responses. When it becomes a dogmatic push to KEEP debating people
when you came into a forum ALREADY disagreeing with them is when it is all
about YOU and YOUR EGO, which is the epitome of a one-sided shindig. YOUR
behavior is the SAME type of dominant tactics that transactivists use to
silence women who don't agree with their agenda of erasure. Go peruse Derailing
For Dummies for reference because your behavior hits all the marks.
·
RD Grimes Jamesa
Stokes - I agree. I've met a few transgender males who dressed as women, lived
as women, but never had the surgery. At least with the surgery we know the
person is serious about being a woman and the person has taken hormone therapy.
I don't know if the hormones decreases the person's strength but at least the
person is medically a female. I would not be against entry to our female spaces
after surgery. However, before surgery I will resist entry. Other women may, of
course, feel different.
Like · Reply · 7 March at 20:15 · Edited
o
Acts Of Faith In Love & Life From
what I'm observing many of the ones who do get surgery are being just as
dominant and misogynistic towards women anyway.
Like · 3 · 7 March at 22:15
o
RD Grimes Acts Of Faith In
Love & Life - Oh my . . .
Like · 1 · 7 March at 22:17
o
Jamesa Stokes Surgery
and hormones don't change a thing, no matter how much the transgender community
tries to make it so. A man is a man. The only thing surgery changes is his
ability to hurt me in spaces where I'm supposed to be safe.
Like · 2 · 7 March at 22:20
o
RD Grimes Jamesa
Stokes & Acts Of Faith In Love & Life - Thanks for
enlightening me. I had no idea . . . .
·
Jamesa Stokes A
lot of the these transgendered males never get THE surgery anyways. Don't trust
'em.
Like · Reply · 4 · 7 March at 19:55
o
Acts Of Faith In Love & Life Most
don't apparently. My support for transwomen was tied into the belief that they
got reassignment surgery and were "all in" so to speak. Now that more
and more are publicly discussing that "we" cannot ask them about
genitalia and they have a right to keep male appendage, I'm giving folks
the side eye. Makeup, boob jobs and saying you're a woman is not enough of a
qualifier to me, especially when you want all the privileges afforded to men at
my expense.
Like · 3 · 7 March at 22:30
o
Elizabeth
Henderson I often wondered why so many transwomen held on
so definitively to the penis. Its because ultimately many are still very
patriarchal and misogynist. They still want to be able to maintain their male
privilege.
·
Venetta Keefe I
don't want to be in a public restroom with a penis That is older than four
years old. What about MY feelings And comfort?
Like · Reply · 3 · 8 March at 00:46
·
RD Grimes As
I wrote on another thread, this action is very troubling. Pre-surgery men
should not have access to women's private spaces. As you've stated,
misogynists, peeping toms, and rapists are worrisome in addition to concerns
about the physical strength of men. Women are extremely vulnerable in this
private space.
Like · Reply · 2 · 7 March at 19:35
·
Jamesa Stokes Megan Massa I'm
gonna start this off and say we're just going to agree to disagree. You are
right, sex is different than gender. Gender is the social construct to which
both sexes, man and woman, are advised to adhere to. There is the masculine
gender and the feminine gender. Just because a woman liked to do what
would be considered "masculine" things and dress in
"masculine" clothing, that does not make her a man. That makes her a
very masculine woman. Similar to how if a man does "feminine" things,
that does not make him a woman. That makes him a very feminine man. I find it
funny that transgenderism works by enforcing the strict gender roles that are
already in place. "Oh, she likes typically masculine things. But society
says that since she's a girl, she should like feminine things. Ergo, she must
be a man."
Where would I be if my mother subscribed to this line of thinking?
The name is TRANSGENDER, not transsexual. Transgender, as in a person acting out the gender that is typically adhered to by the opposite sex.
On the subject of bathrooms: When transgendered men are having issues going to public restrooms, maybe they should be advocating for more respect from the other men who make it difficult for them to go in their own bathrooms in the first place?
On the subject of surgery: Personally, I think the medical profession is taking advantage of these people who, for the majority of cases, are suffering from some type of body dysmorphic disorder, a mental problem that physical solutions, such as surgery and hormone replacement therapy, cannot solve. HOWEVER, those in the transgender community are the one who are making it sound like the solution to life's problems.
Where would I be if my mother subscribed to this line of thinking?
The name is TRANSGENDER, not transsexual. Transgender, as in a person acting out the gender that is typically adhered to by the opposite sex.
On the subject of bathrooms: When transgendered men are having issues going to public restrooms, maybe they should be advocating for more respect from the other men who make it difficult for them to go in their own bathrooms in the first place?
On the subject of surgery: Personally, I think the medical profession is taking advantage of these people who, for the majority of cases, are suffering from some type of body dysmorphic disorder, a mental problem that physical solutions, such as surgery and hormone replacement therapy, cannot solve. HOWEVER, those in the transgender community are the one who are making it sound like the solution to life's problems.
Like · Reply · 2 · 7 March at 22:13 · Edited
